Those who know me will testify that I rarely, if ever, use profanity in my day-to-day speech. (Okay, when I ran the record label there was that one staff meeting when I called that guy an *******, but at the time he really was acting like an ******* and I was merely articulating a consensus view for the purposes of team-building.)
If “Using Profanity” was one of the Seven Deadly Sins, I’d be feeling pretty good about myself right now. Sadly, it’s not. In fact, I just googled “Seven Deadly Sins” – Expletive Hurling is nowhere on the list, and of the Seven that are, I’m pretty sure I’ve broken them all in the last thirty six hours.
I mention this as a way of easing into a potentially controversial topic in some circles regarding the Blue Like Jazz movie…
The screenwriting software I use has a feature called “profanity statistics” wherein all the expletives in a screenplay are magically counted and displayed in a tally. While the CussCount™ for Blue Like Jazz is lower than Al Pacino’s shootout scene in Scarface, it is considerably higher than all the Pixar movies combined.
For most of you reading this – No Big Deal. You assume that a movie set on the “most godless campus in America” is going to contain some measure of “language.” You don’t want it to be gratuitous, like that final shootout scene in Scarface (although who among us can judge what’s gratuitous when we’re riddled with bullets and high on cocaine?). But you expect, in a movie like ours, to hear a certain number of ****s, ****s, ***es, and possibly even the judicious use of ******* when spoken solely as an adjective.
But there are others of you who question the need for any profanity in Blue Like Jazz. After all, there isn’t any in the book, right? Aren’t there plenty of other movies set on college campuses that are good, clean fun for the whole family?
Good points all. While it’s true that the book managed to skirt the issue via Don’s first person narrative, our movie unfolds in dialogue, not voiceover. And yes, there are plenty of college-set movies you can take the kids to, although I believe most were filmed in black and white and include Flubber in the title.
For those who take issue with this news, please know that I’m sympathetic to your concerns. We, the screenwriters, really wrestled with the issue, and while our hope is that we’ve struck an appropriate balance, we suspect that when the movie’s released, your complaints about too much bad language will be countered by those who wanted more.
In the meantime, we offer this olive branch to fans wanting the language scrubbed: We’re open to your suggestions. Really. Please post a reply with your favorite non-curse word or phrase, use it in a sentence, and we’ll try out the best ones as alternate takes.
And for all you merry pranksters who might be tempted to lace your reply with expletives – don’t be an ******.
haha, i love this thread.
I say put in whatever you want. I trust your judgment, and I know this isn’t necessarily intended to be a “family” film. Good luck!
i like flustercluck.
Hi Steve,
I have never heard you talk like that before. *******!
Another earthen vessel whose walk helped draw me to Christ has fell to the ground and shattered…
Tommy recently preached a fine first sermon at 17 yrs. old.
It was very good. He made reference to Christians needing to get off their “butts”. Very well received sermon but one family took offense…. “…children look up to Tommy, he can’t use that type of language!” Maybe that is the problem, too many Christians have no butts!
Your Dad gave me the best advice ever… I was just saved and being discipled by our worship pastor, in our quite conservative Baptist church. “No alcohol!,” I was told. I argued that the bible teaches “no drunkenness,” so I thought, and Jesus turned water to wine. We were at a standoff, Pastor than talked about scantily clad women used to advertise beer. He deflected my objection toward something I had to agree was obvious sin.
I was blindly headed for alcoholism at this time in life, but I was angry at being asked to give up beer and not fully convinced it was sin.
I soon took a road trip and bumped into your dad. I’ll get a second opinion from someone I trust. “Uncle Roland, You know i’m saved now!…My church teachs I have to give up alcohol. Is it ok to drink beer?”
Your wise and godly father, recognizing the conviction I was under, spoke these wonderful words: “You will just have to listen to the Holy Spirit.”
Yes! Yes! He gave me the only right answer! It was sin for me. I have not touched a drop since. My 3 boys have no desire to try alcohol, God broke the pattern of generational sin I was partaking in and I do not feel the need to condemn Christians who do drink in moderation.
I see a parallel here, some obvious sin, no clearcut answer, non-essential doctrine, freedom in Christ and cautious use of that freedom. But only One Counselor whose opinion counts.
We were very discouraged (outraged) at the criticism of our son. It hurt. He loves the Lord! Yet the couple that criticized him were very influential in placing much of the word of God in his heart.
My struggle now is not judging harshly those who judge so harshly.
Love you,
Jeff
“Those who cling to worthless idols forfeit their own grace.”
Jonah 2:8
The dog ran down the street at the speed of lightning, unbeknownst to me until I felt my legs come out from under me and fells screaming, “What in the who-hey was that?!”.
I think you need to leave the bad language in order for the movie to be “real”. Who’s going to believe that on that college campus everyone had a clean mouth? However, their are different levels of bad language some more offensive than others. It would probably help to use the least offensive words to help balance out both sides of the coin.
Steve, I dare you to use the word “plinker-plunk” for ***t! My grandpa did, and we laughed our fool heads off.
-later
actually, I’m so glad you all are taking the approach from the dialogue stand point. Yeah, you HAVE to have some natural swearing in there. Some bursts of anger, frustration, and attitude, and…ultimately, brokenness. Verbal window to the soul perhaps. ; )
Hi Mr. Steve, I remember when I was stationed at Fort Carson, Colorado back in 87 and I had your poster from On The Fritz above my bed. I have always been a big fan of yours and you were always very polite in taking the time to talk to me when I met you a few times. One time was backstage at the dove awards. Anyway, there were times when the stress got to me with my job as a mechanic in the Army and I would occasionally let out a few expletives. Does that make a person bad ? I don’t think so, just human and thank God for his mercy and grace. In this broken world that happens and we just happen to live in it. Your songs always have been real about the world but always bring it back to the truth of God. I feel you will do the same with this project and encourage you to continue to be true to yourself in that respect. I know you are just as normal as the next guy and trust your judgement. Thus going back to the poster on my wall in the barracks. I would think about things in my life and then ask you via the poster what you think ? I know that sounds strange like I am talking to Mother Mary or something but that is the truth. So in my babbling I would say that making the story real would include some expletives. I wish you much success and hope to be able to work with you one day on your projects. I am an actor and have done some work in independent films and well as background work in some major films. (Remember The TItans, Whip It, Stone) and sometimes the characters are flawed as part of the story. So keep up the good work and continue to be truthful. God Bless,
SSG Don Cochran aka Preacher Don
The very fact that you have to talk about whether or not you should swear in a certain movie makes it already a typical Christian debate – and soooo not authentic. But for what it’s worth – I prefer a lack of “typical” slang language and an increase in language that actually says something, not some poor, lazy-man substitute. Focus on the reality of the message in BLJ – for it is crazy, real and poignant as it is. The only type of “swearing” for me that is at all funny anymore is the intelligent cultural parody words – Example: Juno – nary a swear but a load of slang-talking that took it’s place in order to actually be funny again…don’t follow the crowd BLJ, be original and different!
my personal favorite:
“what the blerp?” from 30 Rock = AMAZING!
wordplay would be better than saying the actual words…
in nemo: we’re swimming in our own SHHHH!
in second chance: the wordplay on ass and “as”
or
in national treasure: nic cage gets upset; he just screams
in new in town: she says mother and then the automatic doors close.
Keep it real, Steve ….. keep it real!
Hi Steve,
It drives me nuts when Christ-followers use substitute words instead of cursing. What’s the difference if the thought and intent is the same? Are you more holy because you say “freaking” or “fliipping”? Give me a break. Be real, my friend. Christ liked real…
Zig
At Wheaton College some of us used to combine two stalwarts into one: “Shhhhhell!”
At Predator hockey games I’ve been known to hurl these:
“Raggin’ snaggin’ frickin’ frackin’ son of a badger pup!”
“You sir, are a poopy head….there, I said it.”
“Boiled muskrat gravy!”
“That’s 10 pounds of monkey crap in a 5 pound bag!”
“Shoot that puck up his pooper…sweet sassy molassy!”
“That’s nasal pastry on a Nilla Wafer!”
“Sweet Agnes Sixbutts!”
“I’ll be Roger Mudd’s mother”
“I’m Gumbie, dammit!”
“Boycott shampoo…demand the REAL poo.”
I AM the man from Nantucket!”
“Ohhhh…my nipples are hard!”
“Gadzooks!”
“I could spit nickels!”
“What in the name of Cheezie Petes was that?”
“It’s a dog eat dog world, and we’re wearin’ Milkbone underwear.”
“I’ve seen better movement in a bed pan!”
“Sheisa!”
“You are a hogs-head of sour owl sick!”
“You pendulous breasted Mennonite wet nurse!”
“You regularly seek the the low company of card sharps, dandies, and assorted beasts of the field!”
“You’re uglier than a hat full of buttholes!”
“You thick tongued, lubricious teuton!”
“I mock you with my monkey pants!”
“You sir, are a pyro-flatulatory anal announcement!”
“What a trouser trumpet!”
“Enough of your butt sneeze!”
“I say ‘Hard Cheese’ to you!”
“Celebrate your little cowpie promenade!”
“You’ll smoke a turd in Hell for that!”
“You are a mephetic harlequin cast down by God to torment a weary world!”
“Thou puking pox-marked knotty-pasted scut!”
That shall suffice for now. : )
@Mark:
.
That’s quite an impressive collection you have there, dude. I’m totally adding trouser trumpet to mine. Thanks!
.
peace|dewde
Well, it does bring a whole new shade of meaning to the term “Blue” like jazz…
When I watched Second Chance, I think that the language was definitely necessary. It kept the story real, and the characters believable. They were not holier than thou, and it gave them an earthy quality. Unlike movies like “The Love Dare’ and others where they avoid language all together.. I mean come on! An unsaved angry firefighter is GOING TO swear!
So yeah you can substitute here and there, but not so much that it’s not real.
We all substitute words like Freakin’ and Heck and all that.. and to do that would make it more real.. you should throw in a frak.. just for fun!
I understand and agree that people will not give themselves to a film without a sense of reality. People want to hear people talk the way that they talk.
I also know that you almost cant make a movie in the vernacular without getting an R rating.
I think that a movie with real dialogue can be done with out the overuse of cuss words just like I believe that a real conversation can be made without the use of curse words.
Zig talked about intent. I believe that is the most important. We have given certain “oral noises” a definitively negative connotation. A noise is a noise, it is not the words that condemn a man but the state of the heart. (or the collection of nerve impulses and chemicals that we attribute to the heart)
In the words of Oliver Wendell Holmes: Speak clearly, if you speak at all; carve every word before you let it fall.
If cussing is to be used in a screenplay to add reality it most certainly should not be done perfunctorily. Each word should be weighed. “Is this truly to draw in and convey a message or will it muddle and confuse my message.”
In short, I am glad these decisions are up to you and not to me.
God Bless
I look forward to seeing the fruits of your labor.
Dude! Language in a film a stumbling block?? Hmm . . . that’s like saying a pencil makes you spell bad . . . or a car makes you speed . . . . or the supermarket makes you fat!
The fact is that the BLJ character is somewhat a incomplete person still in process. He smokes, drinks, throws down some words, and if he lands a babe he likes there is no telling how that would have turned out. He was messed up thru alot of the book. That is why we like it so much for OUR story is in BLJ here and there thru-out the book.
If there is no cussing and swearing…then you only have to look to World Wide Pictures to see how it will likely perform to a world audience. After (The Hiding Place) World Wide Pictures did pretty much zilch and it’s films were reserved for the youth groups and church crowd. Is that your target audience. The last thing the church needs is another christian film. No swearing…..then I will remove 90% of the folks on my list I was going to invite to BLJ. Maybe my grandma and mom will want to go out for a night at the movies. Who’s the audience? Who needs to hear the story?
Excellent point, “Dude Looks Like A Dude”! I completely agree!
I agree with Jill. authenticity is the key. if your characters wouldn’t say something, then don’t make them say it. I don’t cuss because when I do, it doesn’t sound authentic. it’s not me. but others do, and while it sometimes bothers me, if that’s who they are at this present moment, I would gladly listen to their story. just tell their story. let your characters be who they really are. we’ll love them right where they’re at. the body of Christ needs to see that…the revolutionary love of Christ penetrating a real life community.
love,
Matthew
P.S.
Sigh. I’ve seen “family friendly” Christians films that scrub the language so pristine that, when combined with bad acting, make the characters look less alive than the figures in the Hall of Presidents at Disney. My friends and I used to describe your music as, “Music for Christians who think.” I expect nothing less than to be able to say the same with your directing. It’s a movie about being a Christian away from the happy clappy Christian haze, let it be there.
At the same time. A friend from high school coined the official Mennonite expletive when we were seniors back in ‘92. If you could include, “Shunk!” somewhere in the dialog I would ROFLM*O.
BOB SAGET!
Speaking of “profanity” in the Bible, I just found this study of 1 Kings 12: http://bit.ly/9AH3l
‘My LITTLE FINGER is thicker than my father’s PRIDE AND JOY
My father burdened you with a heavy yoke.
I will make your yoke heavier still.’
Per the scholar, “little finger” is a whitewashed version of the Hebrew word for the male member. the analogy is, “my nob is thicker than my father’s thigh. He burdened you, imagine how bad I’m going to make it for you.”
I’m not saying pecker should be in BLJ the Movie. But if our ancient forefathers had the guts to write it like it was, why are we so afraid to do the same?
I Dunno – A Cussin’ Pastor without the cussin’! Don’t see how that would work. ‘Liek this thread …. interesting, very interesting. Steve …. you know what you’re doing with this project … go for it!
I’m completely with Jill. Juno is a fantastic example – I laughed harder at her flicks of the tongue than perhaps in any other movie.
Contrast that with Good Will Hunting… a movie I was entirely jazzed to see b/c of who wrote the screenplay, and completely disappointed in… it wasn’t about the swearing – rather, the utter lack of creativity therein. That movie was one big f-bomb.
Like Jill said: be creative. I’m not saying no swearing – just be creative.
Good Will Hunting was an amazing film and the characters spoke the way they did, because they were REAL. Plain and simple. Why on earth do we feel the need to censor reality??? Do you walk around carrying earplugs, ready to block out filthy mouths, so your life is more like the movies you prefer? Here comes the reply, “Well, I try to avoid such people and circumstances.” #@&%$*!
Sorry, I’m just so frustrated with the church lately.
Censoring reality is NOT creative. It’s false. Art is not art unless it is true. And I’m sorry, but Juno was more entertainment than art. Definite strokes of art, but more clever than anything else. The character of Juno did not strike me as an honest rendering of the typical pregnant teenager. Great movie, don’t get me wrong. But, not the greatest example to strive for (regardless of Cody’s Oscar).
I would have cussed, but this wouldn’t have passed the filters. Rant fin.
And don’t bring the clothing example into it. Even though plenty of movies have displayed nudity in tasteful and purposeful manner, as well.
If a very well-written, intellectually and spiritually stimulating book is turned into a common movie – a common denominator type of movie – I won’t be going to it. One thing that attracted me to the book is its depth of thought, how it was deeply personal and illustrated with intelligent conversation with interesting people. It was more like “Fraser” than “Roseanne”. I fear something beautiful is being turned into something common and ordinary. If so, that means a book that would be PG for subject matter – above the interest or intellectual capability of children – will become something PG-13 due to language. That ultimately changes the nature from something that would attract me (a college professor) to something that doesn’t interest me.
Um, may I make a suggestion? There’s an excellent (if not a BIT too long) documentary called “F**k” that I think you should all see before deciding what to do regarding this dilemma. Might put things in an entirely different perspective for y’all.
I like the idea that the movie, like the book, is “nonreligious thoughts on Christian spiritually” and therefore not held down by religious etiquette. Of course, there is plenty of room for modestly tasteful colorful language (you have to draw a line somewhere). Think cable TV language versus Goodfellas language.
this whole thing feels a little absurd to me. the characters should simply speak however they speak. whether that includes no profanity, little, or a lot. the only responsibility you have is to tell the truth, not worry about what will or won’t appeal to whoever. if you make a film that rings true, with characters you believe, the story will find it’s audience. either it is honest to the human experience or is not, this has nothing to do with any sort of limit or quota on cultural vernacular. this is such a christian debate.
censored again! man. guess I was too much of a negative nancy. but this is a passionate subject for me. for the record, i’m not trying to suggest it should or should not contain colorful language, my arguments pertain more to truthful characters and stories in general. either way is fine as long as it’s honest, that’s it (imo). but i hate to be the guy who keeps posting last, so maybe i should type something to get this removed, as well. boobs.
oh, looks like i just didn’t see my previous post awaiting moderation, because i was on a different computer. my bad! me + technology = caveman angry.
A word by any other name … it seems to me that BLJ should be written in the real language of its characters. What I have found most appealing about BLJ, the book, is that I didn’t feel like it was written for a primarily “Christian” audience (and certainly not for the brand of Christianity that is hypersensitive to particular words). It is a book that I like to give to my not-yet-Christian friends because it is so real.
I just finished (M)Miles in a K Years and thought it was even better than BLJ. As I read it, I found myself worrying about all the “Christian” critics that would take issue with the number of times that drinking alcohol or smoking was mentioned … and some references to nudity. I worried that there would be those that would get so bent out of shape by these things that they would miss the beauty and the prophetic challenge of Don’s words.
Just this morning I was trying to figure out whether to show a youtube video of a Todd Agnew song in church. In the song, Todd Agnew, uses the word “slut.” I was so worried that some in the congregation I pastor would get so bent out of shape by the word “slut” that I almost didn’t show the film. But I decided to show it and I’m glad I did. And if I do get complaints on Monday morning, it will give me a chance to talk with the complainers about what it was about the video that REALLY made them feel uncomfortable. Was it the use of a particular word or the challenging message of the song (and of the Gospel itself).
If your characters “need” to curse (ie., if cursing is part of what defines your characters), then let them curse as colorfully as you can without being gratuitous. In terms of your real audience: “Those that mind, won’t matter. And those that matter, won’t mind!”
One of the defining movies, I believe, of my generation was “The Breakfast Club.” As I recall, it had a substantial amount of cursing in it (by 1985 standards, at least). But it would not have been believable if the language didn’t reflect the reality of its characters. I think substituting “poop” for “5h1t” and “fricken” for what is either the laziest or most versatile word in the English language is lame, timid, and luke-warm. So let your 5h1t be 5h1t and your fu…
we spend hours arguing about this and meanwhile we are still losing nearly 30,000 a day to unclean water and kids in my inner city neighborhood are still being shot. we have to become citizens of another kingdom. i cannot imagine that jesus really cares about such a pharisaical (not sure if that is a real word) concern. i hope the movie makes it to production and if it doesn’t–don’s latest book is a pretty good reward for going through the journey (maybe he’ll share the royalties with you guys?!)….or dig wells in africa with it or keep mentoring kids!
First time reading the blog and interesting conversation going on. Swearing, by and large is very commonplace and I think that is why most George W. conservative/evangelicals will balk at the use of any 4 letter word. Please don’t censor the movie because of them. If it’s not a fmaily movie (like any movie about the most godless campus in America would be) just make sure it gets the proper rating. I think if Jesus were walking with us int he flesh today, he would be hanging with people who ask him: “How’s it hangin, biotch?” I wonder how all those meals with sinners and tax collectors went. Do you think they just sat around and praised Him? I think they had real sinful conversations and Jesus was a real person.
for the record, I like “son-of-a-biscuit” and if referring to the BLJ characters man boobs “chesticles”
I myself try not to cuss. I don’t like the idea of using bad language for the sake of using bad language. I like using these, “mother of pearl!” “Sugar!” or “Frick.” However, I recently learned that the word frick is actually German for f***, so use that one with caution.
I read through a few of these and am going to say a few things now. Drinking and smoking aren’t sinning. As far as I can tell there was nothing in the ten commandments about cussing either – only taking God’s name in vain. When a person does something in excess, something that is harmful to themselves, then it becomes a problem. I don’t know if it is a sin or not. I think it isn’t what God wants for us though. He doesn’t want us to hurt ourselves. Cussing isn’t hurting anyone. I think it is only bad because we give it the power to be. I don’t like to use it because I work with kids and I don’t want them to pick up the habit. BTW: I learned in history class what the origin of f*** is. Fornication Under Consent of the King, it is actually just an acronym for sex. Again, it only becomes a bad word when we assign a negative meaning to it.
I like the idea of having the vernacular of a PG – 13 movie in there. If we want non-Christians to come to it, they aren’t going to pay attention to what is being said if it isn’t like other movies. They will pay attention to what ISN’T being said (ie. cuss words) and miss the message.
Fick is actually German for f***, not frick. You could use the German word for s*** which is scheisse. You hear that a lot in movies and it is considered “cool” by those who cuss and doesn’t seem to offend as much since it is in another language (plus my German pastor used it – so it should be ok, right?).
I hate this debate though. Glad it is not my decision to make. Good Christians get another mark against them for not cussing – or wanting to be around it. The other good Christians get to feel superior because they are comfortable with it. Argh. See – glad this is not my decision to make! Good luck guys.
Why be so apologetic about it? It’s a movie, for chrissakes. Those who are offended by it, well…don’t go see it when it comes out.
Who do you want to reach?……Be real!!
If the college people swear…..use swearing. It will be a major turn-off to those you’re targeting if you “substitute” with anything but authentic language used there.
And that, to me, will be just another form of judgmentalism to them…..let’s love them as they are!
i’m kinda tired of this whole debate within Christianity – but whatever you do, please, please…for the love of all that is good and pure…do not use words like ’sugar’ or ‘frick’. actually…that might make a good character! someone who only swears in christianese.
you have to let it flow. if swearing fits the characters or the scene, use it. if it doesn’t, don’t.
you’ll never please everyone.
God wants our genuine hearts.
hope it works out.
almost done reading ‘a million miles’ – burnin’ thru it.
blessings.
can’t wait to see how the story ends!
*spoiler alert* everyone dies in the end, sorry matty. great book though.
Cotton headed ninny muggins has always been my favorite. The confusion it leaves on peoples faces is almost as fulfilling as a real wirty dord.
I’ve been saying eff a lot lately. But it sounds funny when I say it. I say let them cuss as they cuss. But you’ve probably already made up your minds by now.
In thinking about this dilemma my thoughts ran to the Elliott Smith album XO. It is easy to pinpoint the exact songs and verses where Smith drops the F bomb. And I’ve always disliked it. It feels like an easy way out, or a cheap attempt at expressing true emotion, regardless of moral/ethical/religious beliefs. Then I wonder if profanity in music is an entirely different animal than profanity in movies. It kind of depends on how memorable it is in a sense. A brilliant three and a half minute pop song that sits atop iTunes most played is much different than one to a handful of scenes in a 90 min screenplay. Both movies and songs express human emotion and artistic expression, but I don’t mind it as much in movies for some reason.
Can’t we just change the subject to………Your favorite 5 movies and why? This cussing vs sugar coating subject died for this page a few months ago. Question: Who are some of the music artists who should do the soundtrack for BLJ??
I vote for Lost Dogs!! or David Wilcox or Brandi Carlile.
Now that’s what i’m talkin’ about! Lost Dogs, 77s, Vigilantes of Love/Bill Malonee, Andrew Osenga would all be good if you ask me…
My vote on language is: how much did “As good as it gets” have? The one thing i remember thinking about that movie was how appropriate the swearing was – i actually *liked* the swearing. It wasn’t over the top, but it was very much there, and it wasn’t in the background.